TO THE BATPOLES podcast #74: "Batman vs. Two-Face"

[bat-rss]

At last, Batman '66 faces Two-Face! Adam West's final turn as Batman pits him against his classic-TV contemporary, William Shatner, in the animated release Batman vs. Two-Face! Producer James Tucker has said that last year's Return of the Caped Crusaders imitated the feel of seasons 2 and 3 of the original TV show, while this one has a season-one tone... but Tim and Paul beg to differ.

http://tothebatpoles.libsyn.com/074-batman-vs-two-face

[Dan E Kool]

Hey, Paul! What did Scrappy ever do to you?!



I really shouldn't have listened to this episode. I haven't even watched the movie, yet! Really, just no self control. So, now I've heard a lot of spoilers (as I expected to - not blaming you). I regret nothing! Another great podcast, guys.

And a great review, too. It's disappointing to hear that the movie still doesn't quite capture what made the TV show what it was, but the fact that it's Adam West and Burt Ward and Julie Newmar AND Lee Meriwether... I mean, there's no way that I won't watch it. It's tough to imagine that I won't enjoy it, too, to be perfectly honest. Sometimes you're just happy you got anything at all. "Two Face" looks like a good time to me, even if it doesn't hold true to Semple's Season One like I'd hoped.

As for bad animation in the 1970s...



I have no idea what you're talking about.

[bat-rss]

Dan, Well, we didn't enumerate many of the fan-service points and jokes in this one, so those points aren't spoiled for you -- unless you went ahead and listened to the Batcave Podcast's review, too!

[Ben Bentley]

Dan, Well, we didn't enumerate many of the fan-service points and jokes in this one, so those points aren't spoiled for you -- unless you went ahead and listened to the Batcave Podcast's review, too!

...yeahhhhh...sorry about that!

[BATWINGED HORNET]

As for bad animation in the 1970s...



I have no idea what you're talking about.

Yikes. Hanna-Barbera's The New Scooby Doo Movies version of Batman and Robin. Low rent!

Paul and Tim: you guys have a very different view on cartoon than some, but the big takeaway was that the cartoon did not really capture the season one feeling. Unfortunate. It seems the people behind the cartoons have adopted the post 60s stereotype of the series as either silly, a sitcom, or have Batman and Robin be so stiff and preachy (beyond anything seen on the '66 series), that they are walking jokes instead of the action/adventure characters they were in season one.

ROTCC and BVTF's influences almost suggest a perspective shared with that which shaped unforgivably awful Legends of the Super Heroes specials from 1979--that the West & Ward Dynamic Duo were overgrown Boy Scouts out of touch with the reality around them, behaving like someone who was awarded the key to the city decades earlier, but still acts as if his mind is trapped in the past where he's some proud, finger-wagging official who does not get that he's the oddity or joke.

[Jimmy L. 66]

Brilliant episode Gents!

[bat-rss]

ROTCC and BVTF's influences almost suggest a perspective shared with that which shaped unforgivably awful Legends of the Super Heroes specials from 1979--that the West & Ward Dynamic Duo were overgrown Boy Scouts out of touch with the reality around them, behaving like someone who was awarded the key to the city decades earlier, but still acts as if his mind is trapped in the past where he's some proud, finger-wagging official who does not get that he's the oddity or joke.

We somehow missed LOTSH when it aired. I shudder to think it, but sooner or later we're going to have to pay good money to obtain it and watch it for the podcast... Seems that YouTube only has excerpts...

[BATWINGED HORNET]

ROTCC and BVTF's influences almost suggest a perspective shared with that which shaped unforgivably awful Legends of the Super Heroes specials from 1979--that the West & Ward Dynamic Duo were overgrown Boy Scouts out of touch with the reality around them, behaving like someone who was awarded the key to the city decades earlier, but still acts as if his mind is trapped in the past where he's some proud, finger-wagging official who does not get that he's the oddity or joke.

We somehow missed LOTSH when it aired. I shudder to think it, but sooner or later we're going to have to pay good money to obtain it and watch it for the podcast... Seems that YouTube only has excerpts...

Ohhhh, boy. I suggest taking a couple of Bat-Barf Bags along for that trip.

[chrisbcritter]

Casual Friday at the Batcave?

[AndyFish]

I think RETURN TO THE BATCAVE played more like a live action Mermaid Man and Barnacle Boy storyline than anything to do with Batman.

[HoustonBatFan]

No pleasing some people, I suppose. Anyone who sought a new Batman ‘66 episode with no change in presentation or tone from the TV series seems to be missing the point. It’s 50 years later and Bill Dozier & Lorenzo Semple Jr. are dead. It’s a new century, a new creative team, a new medium. I’m thankful to James Tucker for leading the effort to bring us these movies at all.

Most of us aren’t kids; we’ve lived a long time, with decades where reruns were pretty much all we had. We couldn’t even buy the series until a few years ago. Since the legal issues were cleared up, we’ve enjoyed an embarrassment of riches. The series in hi-def, the comics, the costumes, toys and more. These new movies have been the cherry on top of the Batman ’66 revival. I still remember how exciting it was to read the announcement 2 and-a-half years ago that these movies were coming, and I have not been disappointed. They’ve been terrific homages/final episodes. They are products that, even 5 years ago, none of us would have believed would ever exist.

And saying that Batman & Robin in conflict with one another or the inclusion of Two-Face makes it feel less like the series? Any new adventures should give us things the TV series never did. Featuring Two-Face (and casting Shatner) was brilliant. And, sorry guys, you lost me when you admitted that even after watching you didn’t realize Lee Meriwether was in it and didn't recognize Harley Quinn. These things should be obvious to even casual fans.

Lastly, these movies should in no way be compared to Legends of the Superheroes. Anyone who thinks that, just … go to your room.

[BATWINGED HORNET]

I think RETURN TO THE BATCAVE played more like a live action Mermaid Man and Barnacle Boy storyline than anything to do with Batman.

Interesting view. It seems nearly every attempt to produce anything based on the '66 series (even with RTTBC's half flashback format) misses the heart and intent behind the series whether its RTTBC, Legends of the Superheroes and from some opinions, the new animated movies.

I always wondered why Star Trek's movie spin-offs (with the 60s cast) and the animated series captured (more often than not) the heart and spirit of the original series, while every reunion or spin-off from Batman has never captured that magic. Then, I remembered that as inspiration, the original Star Trek series never experienced Batman's many, arguably drastic quality and tone changes over the course of its run. The point being, Batman spin-offs always run the risk of taking inspiration from the worst parts of the series, which seem to be in greater volume than the random three or four bad episodes of Star Trek.

[Bryan Grantham]

Ouch. I believe I fall somewhere in the middle of all of these opinions, I am really conflicted. On the one hand, GLAD these are out there for us fans. On the other hand, wishing they were closer in tone and spirit to the first season. I think there is a little truth in all of these viewpoints, not counting the items (easter eggs) that more well-informed fans may have caught. Nothing, after all these years, could really have caught the 'magic' of those first shows, except a buried time capsule with an unseen episode. Too much time has passed.

[bat-rss]

No pleasing some people, I suppose. Anyone who sought a new Batman ‘66 episode with no change in presentation or tone from the TV series seems to be missing the point. It’s 50 years later and Bill Dozier & Lorenzo Semple Jr. are dead. It’s a new century, a new creative team, a new medium. I’m thankful to James Tucker for leading the effort to bring us these movies at all.

Certainly. I'm puzzled by the take that we didn't like the film. We said at the end that we liked both of them quite a bit.

And, sorry guys, you lost me when you admitted that even after watching you didn’t realize Lee Meriwether was in it and didn't recognize Harley Quinn. These things should be obvious to even casual fans.

On Meriwether, well, I tended to isolate myself from Internet chatter before watching it. Not sure how you might expect us to recognize Meriwether's voice, 50 years after her Bat-appearances.

And since we've stated that we're Batman '66 fans and not fans of other Batman iterations, and Harley didn't even exist in the '60s, I'm not sure how our not recognizing her should lose you.

Lastly, these movies should in no way be compared to Legends of the Superheroes. Anyone who thinks that, just … go to your room.

Even if the films come out better in the comparison?

[bat-rss]

I think RETURN TO THE BATCAVE played more like a live action Mermaid Man and Barnacle Boy storyline than anything to do with Batman.

Interesting view. It seems nearly every attempt to produce anything based on the '66 series (even with RTTBC's half flashback format) misses the heart and intent behind the series whether its RTTBC, Legends of the Superheroes and from some opinions, the new animated movies.

I always wondered why Star Trek's movie spin-offs (with the 60s cast) and the animated series captured (more often than not) the heart and spirit of the original series, while every reunion or spin-off from Batman has never captured that magic. Then, I remembered that as inspiration, the original Star Trek series never experienced Batman's many, arguably drastic quality and tone changes over the course of its run. The point being, Batman spin-offs always run the risk of taking inspiration from the worst parts of the series, which seem to be in greater volume than the random three or four bad episodes of Star Trek.

That sounds right to me. I think those '70s and '80s Star Trek iterations still had a lot of the same folks working behind the camera, too, didn't they? More continuity of personnel than anyone could hope to achieve 50 years later!